Witnessing the erosion of our legal system, while the Mainstream Media cheers it along and gaslights hundreds of millions of Americans that it is justified has been one of the most distressing features of the past three years.
We’ve all been subjected to the psychological civil war and endless coup that began in January 2017, that is ultimately not about Donald Trump. It’s an attack on the US legal system and a daily attempt to overthrow our system of government.
California Representative, Devin Nunes sat down with Siraj Hashmi from the Washington Examiner in a rare interview, in which he is actually treated fairly.
Hashmi is a Left-leaning journalist during a time when his colleagues in the corrupt, Dinosaur Media do not practice fairness, let alone journalism, in their mission to obscure decades of Deep State corruption now coming to light.
Nunes gives an overview of the situation; the criminality, the laws that have been broken and that continue to be broken every day and the legal steps that are being taken.
“It went from a campaign dirty trick to an attempted coup on the presidency of the United States and now we’re in a status of a permanent coup, where, you know we’re gonna have these Ukraine Hoaxes and every day is gonna be something new.”
The politicization of the highest levels of US intelligence agencies under the Obama Administration created fertile ground to germinate this endless barrage of politically-motivated, manipulated intelligence that we’ve been seeing, starting with the “Intelligence Community Assessment” on Russian interference in the 2016 elections to the 2020 sham impeachment.
Nunes explains, the previous administration was rife with cover-ups. “Whether it was the Benghazi attack or the rise of ISIS or the Iran nuclear agreement…all of those things were cover-ups.
“So, it was kind of a slow, rotten decay at the top levels.”
First, there were massive leaks of very sensitive information, such as Lt Gen Michael Flynn’s phone call, as incoming National Security Adviser with the Russian Ambassador.
“Every FBI agent in Washington DC should have been descending on that to figure out how did that leak out…There’s been no investigation. Nobody’s been brought to justice for high-level leaks.”
The “Intelligence Community Assessment”, that Nunes calls the “Obama Dossier” was delivered on January 6, 2017, before Trump was sworn in, alleging that Russia had interfered with the 2016 Presidential Election. It’s ridden with false statements, deceptive word tricks, DNC talking points, partisan media hit pieces and with claims that originated in the discredited Steele Dossier. It appears to have been written by public relations agents, rather than by intelligence analysts. This document, like the Mueller Report and the Sham Impeachment represents a conspiracy by a group of people to defraud the US Government.
The illegally-obtained FISA warrants in the FBI’s “Crossfire Hurricane” counterintelligence investigation into the Trump campaign involved a fraud on the court and a violation of the civil rights of those illegally spied-upon.
With the DOJ and other branches of the Government still infested with members the Resistance, Nunes’ office is currently dealing with an Intelligence Community Inspector General (ICIG) who is refusing to provide evidence to back up their claim that the so-called whistleblower followed all the rules as they relate to the Ukraine Hoax.
“We’re asking for documentation for what the ICIG has said – not to mention that the whistleblower lied on the form and said that he had not spoken to Congress. We now know that he had spoken to the Democrats; the House Intelligence Committee.
“We don’t know who they talked to, because that’s all murky but likely, this is someone who was tied closely and to have known Schiff and/or his staff for for many years. So, another operative…
“If we don’t get that documentation, we will have another referral, based on that.” The criminal referrals are piling up as fast as the crimes daily committed.
It’s obvious, from the synchronization and scripting of fraudulent talking points, that the Dinosaur Media are co-conspirators in this endless coup.
“You can see how many millions of Americans have been poisoned by the content of Legacy Media and Billionaire Media…[and] people don’t know what the Hell is going on anymore.”
As a workaround to the foot-dragging of the DOJ, Nunes is civilly suing CNN, Twitter, McClatchey and Fusion GPS for defamation and libel.
“McClatchy, which is one of the largest newspaper companies in the country, they slander, libel me virtually every day and they’ve refused to retract their stories. Obviously, we spoke about Fusion GPS, which I believe is a racketeering outfit. They’ve destroyed a lot of innocent US citizens and others, so we’re looking at them.
“And then you have the mother of all the Fake News, which is CNN. After the Republicans in the house, even with no witnesses, our [in]ability to call… witnesses, we destroyed their witnesses. By all practical measurement, the House Republicans on the Intelligence Committee destroyed the Democrat’s witnesses.
“Right when that got finished…they slandered me immediately, when we finished that round of hearings, before we left for Thanksgiving. That was a planned and calculated attack on me, to go after my credibility and therefore, the Republican Party’s credibility, all part of the narrative-building that these assassins prostitute themselves in the media to do…”
The Fake News has been engaging in the axiom that, “If you tell a lie enough times, it just becomes true, which is kind of almost a Marxist and Socialist concept, is that and I think the Mainstream Media have convinced themselves, because they want to…believe this, that they just have a right to go out and say whatever the Hell they want about public figures.
“But the truth is, it’s not legal. Especially, if you do it with with malice. So we have a little bit of a higher bar but I don’t think one can argue that that in all of these cases that the malice isn’t clearly there…
“So far, the courts have been ruling in my favor and ironically, none of these slanderous organizations want to meet us in court because they’re refusing to – they’ve slowed down the process to just a crawl, so it’s going to take time but in the end, I have to have faith in that the courts will step in and they’ll enforce the law and ultimately, all of these Fake News stories will come down [be taken off the Internet] and we’ll see where it goes from there.”
“We still haven’t gotten to the bottom of the Black Ledger, yet, OK?…It originated in Ukraine and it was used to to investigate Paul Manafort. So, this was money that Paul Manafort and many other swamp creatures around here, Republican and Democrat, they’ve long been gleaning onto money that’s coming out of the former Soviet countries, especially Ukraine.
“So, somebody wrote essentially a fake document, we believe that dirtied-up Manafort, that triggered a criminal investigation. Now, it looks like later, they did find something that Manafort had done wrong, but it had nothing to do the Trump campaign.
“But that document was fraudulent. Why would people in Ukraine, who created that document, how did it end up in the in the hands of our intelligence agencies and be used to justify this investigation into the Trump campaign, which we now know is all a hoax and wrong?
“So, the idea that myself or Rudy Giuliani would be investigating Ukraine and there’s something wrong with that is nonsense and the media tried to spin that all kinds of different ways. I’ve always said the same thing for a long time: we’ve been looking at Ukraine and continue to look at figures in Ukraine because we want to figure out what the Hell was going on there.”
The entire transcript of the interview is on the page linked below, beneath the video of this interview, which I’ve set to start just past the midpoint, where he gets to the newer developments in the Endless Coup that we’ve heard less about.
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INTERVIEW TRANSCRIPT
Siraj Hashmi: What exactly is Crossfire Hurricane?
Devin Nunes: Well, it was started it was an FBI counterintelligence investigation into the Trump campaign and it started – well, officially started end of July 2016, while President Trump was a candidate…but that’s not true.
It’s a lie. It actually started much before that and we don’t know if it was six months or some people think it could have been 2015 but for sure, it was started early 2016…they were spying on the Trump campaign and targeting the Trump campaign in early 2016 and then they opened an umbrella investigation, that they called called “Crossfire Hurricane” in the middle of 2016.
Siraj Hashmi: You’ve called out the intelligence community for politicizing intelligence, in light of this whole Crossfire Hurricane multiple times. How should we be addressing this?
Devin Nunes: There’s two main buckets of the criminality, here that I believe that Durham needs to be looking at but there’s also another bucket and let me talk about that first.
There’s a bunch of leaks that have happened, massive leaks of very sensitive information that should have never been let out. The obvious one, that everybody knows about is who leaked the phone call with General Flynn talking to, the as incoming National Security Adviser, talking to the Russian Ambassador.
I mean, that massive leak, there…every FBI agent in Washington DC should have been descending on that to figure out how did that leak out? That was such a high-level leak.
Then later, came a leak of the President talking to his counterpart in Mexico and then in Australia. OK, so let’s set that aside. Leaks of classified information, likely gathered from intelligence agencies, leaked out everywhere. There’s been no investigation. Nobody’s been brought to justice for high-level leaks.
So let’s go to those two buckets. One, is the manipulation of intelligence for political purposes and that is – that’s what we’ve said – that needs to be looked into; that people conspired to defraud the Government and that involves the whole Intelligence Community Assessment that was put together, right after the election in 2016, right before Trump was sworn in.
So, that came out, what I called the “Obama Dossier”, because – and 98% of it was fine – I mean, we agreed with 98% of it but there are pieces in it that are still classified that clearly was manipulation of intelligence for political purposes.
That’s one bucket and then the second bucket is, getting back to Crossfire Hurricane is there was fraud on the court and people’s civil rights were violated.
I mean, Carter page is the obvious one but I think many others were were violated, too and that’s a much more complex, broad – did it start late 2015, early ’16 and it went basically all the way until Mueller collapsed in his testimony before the House and Senate?
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Siraj Hashmi: How would you describe the relationship between the media, foreign intelligence services and the IC, the Intelligence Community, as well as some of these private contractors that sort of market themselves as intelligence firms, like Fusion GPS?
Devin Nunes: For the most part…most of the folks that are doing intelligence work for the 17 different agencies that we have in the United States are Patriots. They do very difficult work in difficult situations and do a great job to keep America safe…what happened during the Obama administration is the highest levels of our intelligence agencies became politicized…
There were a lot of cover-ups that happened, whether it was the Benghazi attack or the rise of ISIS or the Iran nuclear agreement…all of those things were cover-ups.
You could also add to that list, the Obama Administration’s lack of interest in Russia and their inability to understand Putin’s plans and intentions, which I’ve called the biggest intelligence failure since September 11th, 2001.
I said that as Chairman of the House Intelligence Committee. Ironically, in the spring of 2016, right at the time they began spying on the Trump campaign, concocting this Russia Hoax that supposedly the Trump campaign was colluding with Russians.
The reality is that, the Obama Administration were colluding with the Russians and they refused to do simple things like provide the Ukrainians with adequate weapons to defend themselves against invading Russians.
So, now all these pieces on that on that international chessboard are tough but the bottom line is that the Obama Administration was busy politicizing intelligence for their own political purposes, which is never good.
So, it was kind of a slow, rotten decay at the top levels…just looking back, now.
Siraj Hashmi: How do you think the media sort of fed into that?
Devin Nunes: Well, the media is really part of the apparatus of the Democratic Party – of the Left – so it’s hard to – no offense to you – but there’s, you know rough numbers, just rough numbers…there’s some science behind this, because you know, the media people who do give money, over time, roughly 90% are Left Wing, which is it’s fine. It’s their right to be Left Wing.
Then, you’ve got maybe 5% that are I would consider Center-Right and you have 5%, just trying to do, I think, a legitimate job but it’s harder and harder to find those folks, because you have to then look at the companies that they work for.
Nowadays, the Legacy Media is gone in this country. People are trying new ways to reach people. I mean, like your podcast, that’s a growing segment but the days of newspapers and Legacy Media networks, they’re all on a slow trajectory downward.
And there are multiple platforms now that are popping up to provide content but when you start with 90% of the content being Left-Wing, then you run it through the lens of Google, Facebook, Instagram and Twitter, which is where most of us are receiving our information, from – most Americans – you can imagine, you stick in 90% of Left-Wing content and then you decide what the Americans should or should not see.
After it comes out of that funnel, there’s a hell of a lot of poisoning going on and I’ve seen that, firsthand just by watching this whole Russia Hoax, Ukraine Hoax, Impeachment Hoax.
You can see how many millions of Americans have been poisoned by the content of Legacy Media and Billionaire Media, being funneled through, coming out and just you know people don’t know what the Hell is going on anymore. The media refuses to even call themselves out on it.
Siraj Hashmi: You mentioned the Iran nuclear deal and how…General Michael Flynn, a target was put on his back because of his thoughts and policy differences with the Obama Administration on the Iran nuclear deal.
First of all, what happened to Michael Flynn? How did this all transpire? His takedown, him being prosecuted, ultimately indicted and sort of found guilty on –
Devin Nunes: Well, we don’t know how this all ends, yet. He’s obviously withdrawn his guilty plea, which I knew from the beginning – because the FBI had told us that he they didn’t think he was lying – and I’ve known General Flynn since the mid-2000s, when I first got to know him, when he was in Iraq.
He’s one of our nation’s top intelligence generals in the last couple generations. I mean, really a man who masterminded the intelligence behind the surge that really led to the elimination of al-Qaeda in Iraq and other places.
So, you know, he’s a he’s a patriot and American Hero and I worked with him on the Trump transition team. He and I were on there and we were mainly looking at the National Security areas, because I was chairman of the Intelligence Committee, so we were meeting with ambassadors from different countries, just trying to put together, interview people for all the different positions.
So, it was a crazy time and I can tell you one thing, that General Flynn is NOT, and that is a Russian agent. That was asinine from the beginning.
Siraj Hashmi: To what extent do you think it had to do with his policy differences on Iran?
Devin Nunes: It was Iran and his concern about the growth of al Qaeda in Iraq, the regrowth of al-Qaeda in Iraq that became ISIS. It was those two issues, why I believe why he was fired.
…I remember he came and briefed us after he had been fired. He came in to brief us in 2015. He wasn’t with Donald Trump. He was willing to help out any candidates, including Democrats, because he was a Democrat, right? All this is lost on people. What’s happened to him is is just a real shame.
And then, as the Trump campaign started rolling, President Trump trusted him. They brought General Flynn in to brief President Trump, who had been a business guy, very good at building things and hotels and golf courses and I would also say he was a Hollywood guy. He had The Apprentice show. Those were his strengths, right. So, he needed somebody like General Flynn, who had been around who could explain, “Hey, here’s what’s happened.”
So, it made sense, as one of the few “Swamp creatures” to support Trump, as a candidate it made sense that he would become the National Security Adviser and then…I believe he was targeted because he knew where all the bodies were buried and he knew that the Obama Administration had seeded, here in Washington, at the highest levels of the intelligence agencies, a bunch of people that he knew were not up to par…He would have brought in a whole new crop of people. And of course, he was cut off at his knees before he even got started.
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Siraj Hashmi: With respect to the IC, the Intelligence Community…I don’t get the sense from you that you just think there’s a cultural problem, say within the FBI or within the CIA or the NSA but at the same time, you have these individuals working in the Intelligence Community, who are, say abusing the FISA process, trying to get warrants to spy on a political campaign – the Trump campaign…how should the counterintelligence investigations be opened and should there be consideration for reforming the FISA process?
Devin Nunes: Well, it’s gonna have to be completely overhauled, in my opinion, the FISA process.
Siraj Hasmi: What does that look like to you?
Devin Nunes: We’re actually in the process of drafting legislation right now with some fixes…One of the key concerns that we have is do we need to bring the Legislative Branch in more, in terms of our oversight and check over the court, because we know one thing: the Court’s not going to police itself, that’s for sure.
The FBI has been reluctant to admit anything actually went wrong.
Siraj Hasmi: Even though the FISA Court acknowledges that there were.
Devin Nunes: But but that’s not entirely truthful, because they were notified a couple years ago, that this problem existed. They had all the intelligence. They didn’t need Horowitz for them to know that there was a problem. The court remains the one that could take some very swift action against especially the lawyers that filed these FISA applications before the Court…
We ended up with a FISA Court, because intelligence agencies were being used in politics. That’s why, in the ’70s we ended up with the FISA Court. So, there’s gonna have to be just something written hard into the law that you cannot target political adversaries…and it never should have happened. They did it in a backwards way.
And you’ve heard the “dirty cops” say this over and over again, ad nauseum, they say things like, “Well, we were trying to protect the Trump campaign,” which was all nonsense. But that’s how they’ve tried to get around explaining it.
Siraj Hasmi: Should the Intelligence Community be able to rely on the information provided by some of these private intelligence firms, say for example Fusion GPS to get a FISA warrant?
Devin Nunes: Well, I’ll limit what I’m going to say about Fusion GPS, because they clearly targeted me. They’ve admitted it in their book. I’m taking them to Federal Court, under the RICO statutes. So, I think they’re a very dangerous organization. I wouldn’t really call them an “intelligence firm” as much as they’re really a nasty media firm, where they plant stories…they basically dig up dirt and plant dirt, fake dirt on their opponents.
They have a long-storied history with that and they were hired by the Clinton campaign to do just that, which is different than say like Christopher Steele and his organization – there’s lots of those little organizations that are all over the globe, which are made up of former spies who build off of their experience, their ability to write up reports. Now, a lot of those a lot of times those those outside firms are very smart they have good connections. They can do good assessments.
The thing about the Steele Dossier, however was is that anyone who’s ever read any intelligence reports knew – you only had to skim through that thing in January, when when most of us first saw it to know that this is not an intelligence report, because Steele didn’t write it. Steele didn’t draft that.
He’s not the author of the supposed Steele Dossier…He just put his stamp of approval on it. And then he was paid to go out and market it and sell it by fusion GPS and the Clinton campaign.
Siraj Hashmi: Operation Medusa: this is something that you and your team sort of worked on pretty intensely to sort of expose the Russian investigation that was being led by the Intelligence Community, being led by the Special Counsel in the FBI. What is the update on that? You had eight criminal files that you had announced in the Spring of 2019…
Devin Nunes: I kind of walked you through the three main buckets, which were the whole FISA/Crossfire Hurricane shenanigans and the manipulation of intelligence and then the leaks.
The others are basically smaller, like lying to Congress, that sort of thing. I’ve never publicly talked about the names of all the people behind that, because I just don’t think it’s appropriate. I mean, we’ve sent over referrals. Everybody that pays any attention to the Russia Hoax or Ukraine Hoax, they know who the players are. They can imagine but I’ll leave that up to Durham. We know there’s an investigation, we know that they’ve been briefed on all of the information that we dug up and I hope that Durham can bring some justice to the process.
Siraj Hashmi: In the last 11 months, after what we’ve seen in the last year do you think there will be more coming?
Devin Nunes: Referrals? Yeah, there should be a referral this is different…
It went from a campaign dirty trick to an attempted coup on the presidency of the United States and now we’re in a status of a permanent coup, where, you know we’re gonna have these Ukraine Hoaxes and every day is gonna be something new.
What has happened in that is we believe there the ICIG [Intelligence Community Inspector General] is refusing to provide evidence to back up his claim that the so-called whistleblower followed all the rules as it relates to the Ukraine Hoax.
Most notably, on whether or not it required first-hand information, which clearly it should. That was what was on the form. That wasn’t, they claimed; that was not what was on the form and that form was changed after the fact. And we have yet to have any evidence of who changed it and where were the drafts of these forms?
So we’re asking for documentation for what the ICIG has said – not to mention that the whistleblower lied on the form and said that he had not spoken to Congress. We now know that he had spoken to the Democrats; the House Intelligence Committee.
We don’t know who they talked to, because that’s all murky but likely, this is someone who was tied closely and to have known Schiff and/or his staff for for many years. So, another operative.
So, to answer your question, criminal referrals: if we don’t get that documentation, we will have another referral, based on that.
Siraj Hashmi: Also part of Operation Medusa, you filed several defamation lawsuits against Twitter, Liz Mayer and then two particular Twitter accounts, Devin Nunes’ Mom and Devin Nunes’ Cow, one of which was suspended. What was your reasoning behind doing that? Like, what what message we trying to send?
Devin Nunes: Well essentially, defamation and slander and libel are not legal in this country and I have no way to get these stories that were planted either by these operatives and then spread by these accounts, spread by other news organizations, spread by Fusion GPS. I can’t get those off the Internet because they refuse to retract those stories. So, that’s what this is about is that I have been defamed and slandered in really nasty ways, that have to be removed or else…if no one has ever heard of me and they go and look up my name, you’re gonna find story after story after story of not just fake news but slander and libel, which is illegal in this country.
So, what we’re doing, what I’m trying to do is get those stories taken down and as it relates to Twitter, you know we’re suing them for their negligence. They knew this was happening on their platform and they enforced the rules selectively…There’s hundreds and hundreds of accounts out there that slander me now on a daily basis, that Twitter knows about.
When accounts pop up that I don’t even consider to be slander, in many cases were just parody after the best example that would be one that got that kind of got some growth early on just a funny account called AOC Press. There was no slander, there was no defamation that was occurring on that, you know. I’m fine with that. That’s not what these are that’s not what these accounts are. They continue the slander on me. So, that’s one of the lawsuits involving Twitter and a few others.
Then McClatchy, which is one of the largest newspaper companies in the country. They slander, libel me virtually every day and they’ve refused to retract their stories. Obviously, we spoke about Fusion GPS, which I believe is a racketeering outfit they’ve destroyed a lot of innocent US citizens and others, so we’re looking at them.
And then you have the mother of all the Fake News, which is CNN. After the Republicans in the house, even with no witnesses, our [in]ability to call…witnesses, we destroyed their witnesses, by all practical measurement, the House Republicans on the Intelligence Committee destroyed the Democrat’s witnesses.
Right when that got finished…they slandered me immediately, when we finished that round of hearings, before we left for Thanksgiving. That was a planned and calculated attack on me, to go after my credibility and therefore, the Republican Party’s credibility, all part of the narrative-building that these assassins prostitute themselves in the media to do…
It’s not funny, it’s wrong that you would say – that anybody would say – that I was taking a trip to Vienna to meet with people that I shouldn’t have been meeting with, OK? That’s just wrong and they used a sole source attorney (if you believe them; we won’t know until we get through discovery), because I don’t believe that’s true – of someone who was working with the Democrats – who they knew was not trustworthy.
They wanted this guy to go out and slander me – and that’s a guy that was trying to get immunity from from the Congress and spinning up conspiracy theories with the Department of Justice.
So, I have this suit against CNN, that I filed…I told them it was false and I filed it you know right after we had returned and I said look, if you’re not going to bring it down, then I gotta go to Federal Court, so now we’re in Federal Court, trying to get that story removed from the Internet.
Siraj Hashmi: Would you say it’s somewhat of an uphill battle?
Devin Nunes: I don’t think it’s uphill at all, other than it just takes a lot of time. I think that’s a misnomer. The law is very clear…Common knowledge, out there…
If you tell a lie enough times, it just becomes true, which is kind of almost a Marxist and Socialist concept, is that and I think the Mainstream Media have convinced themselves, because they want to convince themselves and they want to believe this, that they just have a right to go out and say whatever the Hell they want about public figures.
But the truth is, it’s not legal. Especially, if you do it with with malice. So we have a little bit of a higher bar but I don’t think one can argue that that in all of these cases that the malice you know isn’t clearly there, especially by just looking at the what people say when they’re – I joke about this but it’s somewhat true – they’re out drunk tweeting at night and you can see the malice against me and against my colleagues, so I don’t think it’s going to be a problem…
So far, the courts have been ruling in my favor and ironically, none of these slanderous organizations want to meet us in court because they’re refusing to – they’ve slowed down the process to just a crawl so it’s going to take time but in the end, I have to have faith in that the courts will step in and they’ll enforce the law and ultimately, all of these Fake News stories will come down and we’ll see where it goes from there.
Siraj Hashmi: Moving on to some of the news newer stuff: impeachment. You’ve exposed all this all the this abuse within the Intelligence Community, Lisa Page Peter Strzok, FISA, the Steele Dossier and when you come to impeachment, you have the whistleblower complaint, impeachment inquiry – is it all part of the same plot?
Devin Nunes: Yes.
Siraj Hashmi: How so? Where’s our throwing line right there?
Devin Nunes: Matt Gaetz is very funny guy, congressman from Florida. He calls the Ukranian Hoax just “the cheap knockoff version of the Russia Hoax” and so what happened with the with the Russia Hoax, it was very dangerous, because as you know, you had high-level officials involved in it, with real with real power.
What happened with the Ukraine Hoax, many of the same players, right after Mueller completely imploded, they concocted this idea that Giuliani and Trump were doing something nefarious in Ukraine, which was all just total nonsense, because the truth is that there’s a lot of problems with Ukraine…
“You know, when they build a narrative and then just continue to lie about it? So, what was their narrative, that came out of this?
“The Republicans and Trump are denying that Russia had…tried to manipulate the election and they’re blaming it on Ukraine now.”
Nobody ever said that…the report that has been out the longest was the report that we did, the House Republicans did and released you know two years ago and we said that look, Russia’s been doing this for, even back going in Soviet Union days. They’re gonna continue to do this. Vulnerabilities are out there. Don’t put any voting apparatuses on the Internet, at all, right which is kind of relevant nowadays [referring to the phone app that crashed the 2020 Iowa Democrat Caucus], since I don’t know what morons would think it was a good idea to use an app, at all for any voting, whatsoever.
We should not be having any voting done, at all of anything that jumps onto the Internet and rides over the fiber network. So, we’ve been the ones that…have talked about and confirmed that the Russians do bad and nefarious things and will continue to do so. But they built a narrative that we’re like into denial of that and now we’re shifting and blamed it on Ukraine.
Well, the truth is, is that no, we’re the ones who actually – they didn’t even read our report, they mocked our report – so, we’re the ones that confirmed that Russia’s nents did this, the very first ones – and oh, by the way – they’ve refused to investigate, at all!
What the Hell is Fusion GPS and other Democratic operatives doing in Ukraine, that led to high-level Ukrainian officials bashing the Trump campaign in 2016, which is unprecedented? It’s unprecedented to have a diplomat in Washington DC even from…our adversaries, you seldom see them take sides in a presidential race.
Matter of fact, I don’t know of another example that I’ve seen. There probably is one out there but to go with a public attack against a campaign in a local Washington DC rag, I think is unprecedented. So, clearly, there were operations that were being conducted in Ukraine.
Our investigation, that they’ve continued to ignore – we know Nellie Ohr testified, who was a Fusion GPS operative, whose husband was the conduit of taking stuff into the DOJ, Bruce Ohr, one of the highest-level civilian DOJ officials.
And I don’t mean to throw all these words out but I’m guessing your your listeners know most of these names? We know that she said that some of the sourcing did come from Ukraine. She testified to that to our to our committee. So, the Fake News media out there, they can prostitute themselves all they want but it doesn’t change the facts.
Our only battle, that we have as Republicans is to try to get around that funnel, get around like I started with the 90% of the content gets shoved into the funnel and then we see it through Google, Facebook and Twitter and it’s poisoning Americans. We’ve got to figure out ways to go around that, which is why, you know I do things like my own podcast, it’s why I come on podcasts like yours, because we’re trying to reach people and get outside of that funnel, even though people might be on the watching this on YouTube – but you have no other platform to really put this on. I mean, you’re kind of a prisoner and so am I. I mean, I have to use, you know iTunes.
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Siraj Hashmi: Obviously, President Trump is well within his Executive Rights and Constitutional Right to say, hire, fire or reassign anyone he wants. Do you think it was the right think to do?
Devin Nunes: So, I think it’s relevant because it gets back to how we started this podcast, talking about General Flynn. It’s what General Flynn was going to do when he came in, and so this needed to be done over three years ago. It’s what General Flynn was planning to do, as National Security Advisor. The size of that National Security staff was, at one point over 500…and they were left with all sorts of Obama-era holdovers. That’s like the example of having the fox guard the henhouse.
So, I’ve been saying very publicly for a long time; I’ve said it all sorts of different ways but they should remove everybody from the White House grounds that was there pre-Trump and just isolate them somewhere else, until you can figure out who’s doing the leaking. And the bottom line is this: it’s not like these people have been fired. They’re still working for the Government.
Siraj Hashmi: In the midst of this impeachment affair of President Trump, he was acquitted, Democrats accused you of having ties to Ukraine – at least in November, which you cite that CNN report, that you had gone to Vienna to meet with former prosecutor, Viktor Shokin, who Joe Biden, when he was Vice President advocated to fire, because he was looking into corruption in Burisma, who his son, Hunter was a board member of.
But they specifically say there were calls between you and Lev Parnas…to what extent would there be, say a necessity that he would reach out to you? Do you think it was do you think it was something that you know was relating to Joe Biden or do you think that you may have been set up?
Devin Nunes: It goes back to everything that we’ve been talking about. We’ve been investigating Ukraine for a long time and we continue to investigate Ukraine, because we’ve been trying to figure out why were all these high-level Ukrainian officials involved in the attacks on a political campaign on the Trump campaign in 2016?
We still haven’t gotten to the bottom of the Black Ledger, yet, OK?…It originated in Ukraine and it was used to to investigate Paul Manafort. So, this was money that Paul Manafort and many other swamp creatures around here, Republican and Democrat, they’ve long been gleaning onto money that’s coming out of the former Soviet countries, especially Ukraine.
So, somebody wrote essentially a fake document, we believe that dirtied-up Manafort, that triggered a criminal investigation. Now, it looks like later, they did find something that Manafort had done wrong, but it had nothing to do the Trump campaign.
But that document was fraudulent. Why would people in Ukraine, who created that document, how did it end up in the in the hands of our intelligence agencies and be used to justify this investigation into the Trump campaign, which we now know is all a hoax and wrong?
So, the idea that myself or Rudy Giuliani would be investigating Ukraine and there’s something wrong with that is nonsense and the media tried to spin that all kinds of different ways. I’ve always said the same thing for a long time: we’ve been looking at Ukraine and continue to look at figures in Ukraine because we want to figure out what the Hell was going on there.
Siraj Hashmi: Did the impeachment inquiry or anything like that sort of open up that?
Devin Nunes: No, because all this was done – matter of fact…once we had that that information from Nellie Ohr, when she had testified, that was a lead.
We knew the Black Ledger was a problem. We knew we had all these people. So we were looking at this and all through the end of ’18 into early into early ’19, in the Spring and so, you know we were talking to all sorts of cast of characters that would bring us information.
And we have every day, people call this office or the House Intelligence Committee office and they say or they email and they say, “We’ve got information that the Congress needs to see. We’re an oversight committee, that’s what we’re here for. We’re here for Americans, foreigners, they can bring us information that they think we need to have and so, the whole issue – you asked about about Parnas.
I didn’t know who that Hell the guy was. I didn’t know his name and so when that all first broke, I had to go back and look at all the records, so the media’s continued and the Left has continued to lie about that; that I had said something any different.
All I said was, “I’m not gonna trust whatever phone records you guys release.” Once I looked at my phone records, there was one one call, despite that they say, I listened, I didn’t remember the guy’s name and then I referred him over to the appropriate staff, which that will happen today, I guarantee you at least once, if not five times.
I’ll meet with foreigners every day. I meet with you know foreign ministers that come in to see me. I meet with intelligence agencies that come in to see me from foreign countries and we have people that drop stuff off at this office, email, phone calls, etc, etc. Every single day, that’s what we do, so the idea that that this guy, Parnas and his buddy, who clearly have an axe to grind – they’re American citizens they have an axe to grind in Ukraine – they think they had information.
The reality is, we don’t have any information from them. They never provided anything but they have the right, as American citizens, as do all people to bring us information. And for anyone to make any light of that or even question that, it’s only because you’re trying to build a false narrative, because you got your ass kicked in the Russia Hoax you were in on it the Ukraine Hoax they were in on that – and the fact that they would believe somebody who’s now probably gonna go to jail for a long time and indicted on many felonies, like Parnas, they ought to be embarrassed of themselves. But I’ve been around long enough to know they’re not going to be embarrassed of themselves.
Siraj Hashmi: Well, Congressman Devin Nunes from California, representing the 22nd Congressional District, thanks so much for joining us.
Devin Nunes: A pleasure. Thanks a lot.
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